Tormach 1100

[JimsMSM]

I'm considering replacing my Mill with a Tormach 1100. I've been using MSM and Love It and want to check if anyone is using a Tormach 1100 (3-series) and if there are any issues with MSM? Thnx

[DaveCVI]

Hi,
MSM runs fine on Tormachs - we have multiple tormach owners using MSM.
tormach ships an ancient 2.6 level of mach with their machines while MSM requires 3.43.22+ (3.43.66 preferred). So you'll have to update mach from the version tormach supplies.

The other item to be aware of is that tormach locks down their mach version and requires a waiver if you want to unlock it to run a different mach version. It's no big deal, tormach just doesn't want to answer support questions about things they did not supply. So if you are talking a used tormach, this is a non-issue, if you are talking new, then talk to tormach about this.

What I've seen several people do is that they just leave the stock tormach mach install as is, then install a separate copy of newer mach and run that (the tormach mach lisc is good for all vers so you just copy the lisc to the new mach dir also.
Then run what you like,while still being able to start the tormach mach version if you want to call then for a specific support question.

Dave

[JimsMSM]

Thnx for the info Dave. One other question please: Is the Tormach ATC controllable by MSM? The Tormach videos I've seen on their auto-tool-changer appear to have additional Mach-screens I haven't seen before?

[DaveCVI]

Hi,
I thought I answered this post late yesterday, but I'm not seeing my response... hum... So I'll do it again.

Thnx for the info Dave. One other question please: Is the Tormach ATC controllable by MSM? The Tormach videos I've seen on their auto-tool-changer appear to have additional Mach-screens I haven't seen before?

I don't know what to say about the tormach ATC. I know MSM users that are running Tormach's but I don't think I've heard from anyone that I know is running their tool changer.

From a technical standpoint, I don;t know how they choose to interface the tool changer actions to mach. In theory anything they could have done on mach 2.6 couls be done with mach 3.43 - but that's the general answer starting from the raw ATC hardware. Whether this would be practical or not would depend on how tormach wrote the ATC software - if it is reusable tings could be easy, if they choose to tie it to their mach version only (say by checking explicitly for the tormach mach version from compiled scripts) then it could be hard or impractical.

If you are thinking about buying a new Tormach, then you're a guy waving the stack of cash at them - that tends to make vendors more responsive Ask them if there is technical documentation about the ATC control interface. If I had some info on what they did, I'd be happy to further figure out what would be required to make the ATC run under MSM. I'm thinking there will be some effort needed since this all involves M6 sequences, power draw bars etc- because MSM uses custom M6 scripts to do ATLO, Master tool mode etc, there is likely to be some integration work to be done.

Dave

[JimsMSM]

Dave, I corresponded with the Tormach folks and they're pretty firm on Not supporting anything but their version of Mach and their ATC software. I can't give up MSM just to use their ATC, so:
My potential plan:
- Thinking about building my own ATC with separate controller and a couple steppers to turn the carousel and slide the appropriate tool under the spindle at the TCP
- Assuming I will have the same 10 or 12 tools always loaded in the carousel and all measured using Master-Tool w/TLOs in my Tool-Table
- When my G-Code hits a T#-M6, M6ATC is called:
-- I'm comfortable I can write the M6ATC code to turn the carousel to the correct slot and rail the tool under the spindle at the TCP
-- Tool is loaded via the auto draw-bar
-- I would use my MT to touch-off and should be on my way ?
Appreciate your thoughts if you think this is doable without adding additional screens? If additional screen-sets are required, this may be beyond me.
Thnx Much

[DaveCVI]

Dave, I corresponded with the Tormach folks and they're pretty firm on Not supporting anything but their version of Mach and their ATC software. I can't give up MSM just to use their ATC, so:

That just made my day! one of the best endorsements of MSM I've had

I do think that's rather short sighted of Tormach.. they'd rather loose a $5k ATC sale than cooperate to make a customer happy? That's a departure from their usual reputation for customer service. ... and a bit odd since I've had good interactions with them on other things.

My potential plan:
- Thinking about building my own ATC with separate controller and a couple steppers to turn the carousel and slide the appropriate tool under the spindle at the TCP
- Assuming I will have the same 10 or 12 tools always loaded in the carousel and all measured using Master-Tool w/TLOs in my Tool-Table
- When my G-Code hits a T#-M6, M6ATC is called:
-- I'm comfortable I can write the M6ATC code to turn the carousel to the correct slot and rail the tool under the spindle at the TCP
-- Tool is loaded via the auto draw-bar
-- I would use my MT to touch-off and should be on my way ?

Yep - should work great. you can think of the ATC as a replacement for what the human does in mach's stop & wait mode. Once the tool is mounted, MSM can then go do the measurement - but MSM doesn't really care whether an ATC or a human mounted the tool.

We could even prototype the MSM side before you make the changer if you want: we'll simply make a M6ATC script that waits for human input (ex: click ok in a msgbox), then works with MSM to let MSM do it's measurement actions. Essentially, this turns ATC back into Stop&Wait, but running the M6ATC code, then all you need to do is alter the M6ATC script to suit the changer and draw bar as it gets built up.

Appreciate your thoughts if you think this is doable without adding additional screens? If additional screen-sets are required, this may be beyond me.
Thnx Much

If you need place to put controls for the ATC, that's what the "user exts" page in MSM is for. No one's needed more pages to date, but that's also possible (and I'd help with that if need me).

Dave